early 70's twin axle franklin

[Deleted]

Hi, I'm new and this is my first thread creation. I have been looking at many threads and seeing some of the great things all you guys are doing with old vans, which has inspired me to do some repairs and renovate our old van.  My wife and I inherited this when my parents upgraded to the latest Jayco.  We have been holidaying in it for the last 8 years, and prior to that as a youngster my parents would take us away in it.  They have pictures of my brother and myself age 4 in the bunks, I'm now 42.

The old van has been leaking in all corners for a while and after seeing the work being done in the forums, I thought I'd give it a go.  So here she is, and the project pull down has begun.  Back end of the van is off, bed out and rear draws and bedside cupboards removed.  Main rot is in rear sill and down one wall.  Hoping to get more done this weekend.

Cheers

Trav

[Deleted]

I look forward to watching you create some new memories with your lovely van Trav

[snoops]

Nice van. . You will get all the help and encouragement you need to get the job done here. Good luck, and don't forget to post plenty of pics.

[Mustang]

Your history doubles the fun factor.
Like any job you are over the hardest part by starting, & what a start.

[Deleted]

Hi Trav,
Nice looking van you have there,one of the "up market" Arrows,with wrap around windows and a few other luxuries for the time.
Glad to see you are doing the job properley!
Cheers
hughdeani

[myarrow1]

Great looking van Trav. The joys of water damage ! Keep up the progress pics.

[awbeattie381]

nice old van! Love the history too! Keep up with the updates!

[Deleted]

Thanks for the encouragement.
Starting to look for parts on line, should they exist!! Also, when I get to the front end, ie a new drawbar as required, I should be able to uncover the chassis number to confirm age. It is currently hidden under the after market addition annex pole holder.
I went out and purchased a whole lot of tools on the weekend that I believe will assist with the job now at hand, so the scrap book of spending has begun...... Is this something I should pursue, or just put it down to being the expense of a new hobby so I don't scare myself when all is said and done? And realistically, I don't want the wife to see, she might suggest we should have purchased a new van if the renovation costs get up there!!
Looking forward to getting stuck into it.

[myarrow1]

Hi albinochimp

are you looking to keep it all original ? You may be surprised at the dollar figure, if you're doing the work yourself. 

[Deleted]

myarrow1, yes looking to keep it original. I think the item I am going to find the most difficult is the interior woodgrain light coloured ply pattern and probably the benchtop.  I have a mate who does kitchens, so hopefully he might be able to pull a rabbit out of the hat for the bench pattern.  See photos attached.

[Mustang]

This supplier has a lot of ply products, not sure where you are?
link

[planner]

Aug 31, 2015 20:44:45 GMT 10 @albinochimp said:

I have a mate who does kitchens, so hopefully he might be able to pull a rabbit out of the hat for the bench pattern.  See photos attached.

I too have mate that does kitchens, he laughed at me when I asked him to source a 40 year old laminex pattern Ours was marbled green.

You'll find plenty of suggestions/recommendations for the ply if you trawl through the other reno's, most people have opted not to match original, although your white may still be available.

I would love one of the tandem arrows, but there too long to fit in the shed. Looking forward to watching progress.


Planner

[myarrow1]

Hi albinochimp 

i agree, original is the go. They (Franklin and 70's vans in general) have so much character.

i gave up trying to source a ply match, so I'm just going to line the rear bedroom end, just below the window line all the way round, leaving the upper section original.

i have made a start (as per my pics), and I was relatively impressed how it looks so far.

the bench top and the rear drawer set, the stove cover and shelf next to it, I reckon I will look at a White Melamine or that type of thing. I did see an Arrow on Gumtree ages ago where this was done, and it looked great

[Deleted]

Sept 1, 2015 7:14:30 GMT 10 Mustang said:

This supplier has a lot of ply products, not sure where you are?
link

Thanks Mustang. I have bookmarked this for future reference. I think there are definitely some options there.

[Deleted]

Sept 1, 2015 10:53:16 GMT 10 planner said:

Aug 31, 2015 20:44:45 GMT 10 @albinochimp said:

I have a mate who does kitchens, so hopefully he might be able to pull a rabbit out of the hat for the bench pattern.  See photos attached.

I too have mate that does kitchens, he laughed at me when I asked him to source a 40 year old laminex pattern Ours was marbled green.

You'll find plenty of suggestions/recommendations for the ply if you trawl through the other reno's, most people have opted not to match original, although your white may still be available.

I would love one of the tandem arrows, but there too long to fit in the shed. Looking forward to watching progress.


Planner

Jeez thanks for that Planner.  About 12 months ago we redid our kitchen via the mate and I remember there being a thousand different options.  But as you suggest, there are style changes over time.  Hopefully there are some of the 70's patterns coming back around, but I am not holding my breath..

[Deleted]

Hey myarrow1, Yeah I was looking at your work the other day in regard to the panelling over the bottom half of the wall and thought it came up good. I think it might be the option for me as well. One side can be hidden mostly behind the draws and rear bench. I might even be able to use some offcut to keep the original that is visible above the bench and below the window.
I'll keep trawling the net for the laminate and ply. I did find a local supplier of ply who at the time showed me a plain white ply. Might see what else they have and if there is anything of interest, I'll post it.

[Deleted]

Well, a bit more investigation tonight on the van and found there really isn't much holding the walls to the chassis. Removing about 5 rusted, inch long bolts (of which 3 came out at only about 10mm long) and 6 rivets along the bottom of the rear quarter, the quarter of the wall is disengaged from the chassis. I was able to get a jimmy bar in and gently lever the wall off/away from the chassis.
The plan now is to do the same along all the underneath of the walls, removing screws and rivets, gently left the walls from the chassis with jacks, while levering the cupboards from the floor ply and cutting the nails with a demo saw, thus lifting the whole van from the floor and chassis, allowing it to be wheeled out from underneath the walls and roof. This hopefully will also allow easier access to the bottom timber rail where spots of rot will likely be revealed.
Sounds simple when I sit here typing it.
I will post photos of this as I do it, step by step, and hopefully success by success.
I figure the above method will be the easiest way to deal with the soft floor ply, the rust on the chassis, check it all over, replace the drawbar and any other rusted out parts. 30+ years of summers on the NSW south coast has taken its toll on the underside of the van. One good thing about the setup underneath is that it has had electric brakes for as long as I can remember, so no dramas with brake system rebuild required.

Just on anyone who has replaced a drawbar and extended its length, has it created extra weight on the ball by much?

Thanks

Trav

[Deleted]

Aug 29, 2015 9:15:15 GMT 10 @hughdeani said:

Hi Trav,
Nice looking van you have there,one of the "up market" Arrows,with wrap around windows and a few other luxuries for the time.
Glad to see you are doing the job properley!
Cheers
hughdeani

Hi Hughdeani,

I was wondering what the model was as I have rarely seen the wrap around windows.  As soon as I can see the VIN number I'll hopefully be able to ID the year on the old girl.

I don't know what 'luxuries' there are as extras for the time but the oven/grill and stove are pretty good for the time.  They all still work, as does the 2 way fridge.  The fridge is a bit of a pain to light.  I have to lay on the floor with a lighter to get the pilot lit, but once going, she's super cold.  The fridge will be getting a bit of a coast of paint and aluminium polish to bring it back to life.  There's a lot of work to do, but I am looking forward to the challenge.  Friends all have new vans with all the home away from home luxuries, but they all love coming and looking at our van and the kids love sitting around the table playing games, its huge compared to all tables in vans today. 

Do you have any tips on the type/brand of sealant to use around the van when the rebuild begins?

cheers

Trav

[Deleted]

Hi Trav,
Some of these arrows with the wrap around windows were called Franklin Statesman.
They had a few extras which set them apart from the standard Arrow,and if my memory serves me correctly they were cloth upholstery,glass display cabinet somewhere inside(glass doors),wrap around windows,clock and holland blinds and terelene curtains,and possibly more,but I just can't remember!
They came out in about 1970.
Hope this helps
Cheers
hughdeani

[Deleted]

You certainly have a lot of caravan info, on many makes, looking at threads. You are correct. The upholstery in ours is vinyl, all still in good nick as mum covered them some years ago. The table cushions for converting the table into a bed are still in the van too. Glass door cabinet is above the stove, clock with alarm mounted in the cupboard, and bloody loud I might add!! The blinds and curtains are a yes too, although again mum changed the curtains a while back. I'll see if I can scratch up the photo of my brother and I in the bunks back in about 1978, should show the original curtains!
thanks for the details.
Cheers
Trav

[snoops]

I've extended the draw bar on mine and yes, it did increase the nose weight, but I've rearranged things like the batteries, etc and now have it back to where I'm happy with it. The new draw bar made a HUGE difference to how it tows, and it is now rock solid at 100KPH. I also made the draw bar so it now attached right to the front spring hangers, then it's attached to the chassis in 6 locations, with a total of about 500mm of welds, so it isn't going anywhere... . If your draw bar is a bit suspect, I would highly recommend replacing it, it was the single biggest improvement I made to mine.

I wish you luck separating the the van from the chassis - you are on the right track, but I managed to just cut all the old bolts out, replace about 2 metres of rotted timber, and put all new bolts back in by just pulling the part of the wall I was working on out just far enough to slip the new timber in.

there are details of both in my thread - ditzygypsy.proboards.com/thread/2558/new-old-75-franklin?page=3

if you need any more pics, just sing out.

[Deleted]

Hi Snoops. Great job on your van by the way. It has come up awesome. You certainly don't have to spend a fortune to have a great van and get away like everyone else.
Thanks for the detail. The drawbar has a number of rust holes on one side. I have been towing it with some reservation the last few holidays, and it was the driving force for the reno. I currently run an old setup of level-riders which really assist with the tow of the van. 100kmh is not a problem. Van sits in nice behind with no sway. But I do feel the van sits a bit close to the car and also needs one of the jockeys wheels on the swivel attachment so it doesn't need to be removed from the van. As part of the reno I am trying to make the van safe, sealed and user friendly so the wife can take it away with the kids during the summer months as my work is at its busiest during mid Jan to early April so I cant get away on weekends.

I had a look at your whole thread on your reno last week. The drawbar looked awesome and as though it could fit all the required bits and pieces one might want on it, including that "weather proof" hot water service you got!! Bloody dodgy products. Will take your advice on the anchoring back the to the hangers. I'll have to check that it wont interfere with water tank location.
Hey, just a quick question, when you replaced the timber on the bottom section I saw you had removed the L mould. Did you reuse this or purchase a new length of it? And if so, from where?
I am feeling confident in removing the walls and roof of the van from the chassis, keeping everything intact. After last nights little bit of investigation I think it will be doable. Spoke to my brother this arvo and will probably rope him in on the project as well. He is a shopfitter so has experience with wood and aluminium etc.
Reading about your inverter too, got me doing some research about them for looking at installing as well. But then thought, lets get the basics sorted and then think about the fancy details.

Love the 101 tow vehicle. How is the Bluetooth connection on the stereo for connecting Spotify for the long trips? I haven't been able to find any reviews about it online....

[snoops]

The J moulds came off in good condition, so I have reused them, I just hammered a few kinks straight on the back of the vice.

Yes, the 101's sophisticated electronics can be daunting to some, and it seems the Automotive Journalists couldn't figure them out, so just left that bit out... The windows are also very technical and to get any airflow at all. The door tops just need removing and chucking in the back - just 2 nuts to undo, how's that for practical!

[Deleted]

Wont find those windows going up and down by themselves after a deep river crossing!! Mind you, it would have to be about a 2m deep river crossing in that beast.

Judging by the aerodynamic design of the tow vehicle, the van fits perfectly into the Jetstream....

Is she hot in the cab generally on a long trip? We used to have a 6 wheel drive ex army acco tipper at work and she was great in the winter, but frikkin hot in the summer.  Sitting on the motor has its advantages at different times of the year.

[snoops]

Yep, she's a regular little furnace on hot days. . I have driven it plenty of times with temps in the low 30's and its ok with the door tops removed, but once the Mercury passes 35 it gets unpleasant, and above 40 it's almost lethal...     But, I love it to bits and wouldn't have it any other way.  

If your interested, I've got a thread running on it over on AULRO - www.aulro.com/afvb/101-forward-controls-variations/175280-gavs-101-a.html.  There's nearly 550 posts there so it should keep you out of trouble for a bit.