greyjac
Newbie
Family of 6 looking for affordable adventures!
Posts: 9
|
Post by greyjac on Mar 3, 2019 17:50:42 GMT 10
Well i'm excited... We are currently towing this beauty home... someone has half gutted it. A lot of work but bones are great. Chassis number is PV80289... any ideas on exact year and Model? We were told its a Royal but I thought that would have been R80289...  IMG_3884 by JLydiaK87, on Flickr  IMG_3887 by JLydiaK87, on Flickr Anyway... have 4 kids and we're going to triple bunk it at front end here and sleep one on the lounge bed. Packed!!  IMG_3889 by JLydiaK87, on Flickr I would love advice on: cheapest new 2 way fridge Most cost effective deep cell battery system + solar system. Also approximately how much does it cost for an electrician to rewire the whole van? |
|
|
|
Post by Mustang on Mar 3, 2019 18:03:45 GMT 10
Hi Grayjac,
Welcome to the Classic Forum.
You have a good start there to a great reno, keep in mind the electric brakes may need replacing, not expensive, & check your chassis for strength.
A Sparky will cost you by the hour $60/100. Not many will quote unless you are prepared to run the cabling yourself, same with the 12v.
12v is not hard or dangerous if you follow guidelines. Google Caravan electrical by Collyn Rivers, his books are great.
A portable solar panel is more convenient than a fixed panel. You should be able to get by with a 120 amp hour battery if you set your 12v up with led lights etc.
Most new 90 liter 2 x way fridges work well.
Cheers
Brent
|
|
greyjac
Newbie
Family of 6 looking for affordable adventures!
Posts: 9
|
Post by greyjac on Mar 3, 2019 23:15:38 GMT 10
Thank you Mustang! This forum was a great resource to us in deciding whether or not to buy it. It's our 3rd van, but our first viscount  That info you posted is helpful, thanks! We are about to rip everything else out carefully and replace the floor first. Nervous laughter from me! But worth doing. |
|
|
|
Post by twocutekelpies on Mar 4, 2019 3:59:11 GMT 10
Well i'm excited... We are currently towing this beauty home... someone has half gutted it. A lot of work but bones are great. Chassis number is PV80289... any ideas on exact year and Model? We were told its a Royal but I thought that would have been R80289... Hi Greyjac, I'm not sure what the PV stands for but have come across it a few times now for 1977/78 Royals so can confirm 1978 Royal for yours. I maintain the known chassis number register and have been able to collate over 800 numbers now with a lot of help from Viscount owners. I'm also renovating a '73 Viscount Ambassador, looking forward to watching your progress if you're keeping us updated. Cheers Shelley |
|
|
|
Post by snoops on Mar 5, 2019 18:22:32 GMT 10
Welcome along - looks like a great project! Regarding solar and batteries - what are you hoping to run with the 12 volt system? You can go from the small to the ridiculous. I for example run 4x100 Ah batteries and 500 watts of solar but I run everything off the 12 volts - 90 litre Engel fridge, all lighting, TV, inverter for some 240 volt stuff like pedestal fans, etc. I also camp out in Winter when returns into the system are negligible for days on end. Even then, it’s overkill but that’s just me. 😁. Most wouldn’t need anything close to this - if you just want to run your lights (use LED globes), and some USB outlets to charge phones, etc then 1x100Ah battery and a 120 watt solar panel would do for most things you need. If you get a cheap folding panel and put it out when you’re camping, that’s the easiest and cheapest way too. This won’t add too much cost or weight to your build. Do note though that a GOOD deep cycle 100Ah battery weighs around 30kg - if you’re looking at one that weighs a lot less, chances are it won’t last long - cheap batteries are a false economy. While you may not need to spend $400 plus on a battery, don’t think that a $150 or $200 one of fleabay will do the job, it won’t.
As for the 240 volt stuff, ring around - A lot of Sparkies may not want to touch a Caravan - depending on where you live, I could quote this for you and do you a Forum discount. 👍. I’m in Vic - can do anywhere in Melbourne and surrounds, out to Ballarat, Bendigo, etc.
|
|
|
|
Post by bogwot on Mar 7, 2019 7:03:22 GMT 10
Definitely do the wiring yourself. Then get the electrician to do a check. When rewiring, make sure you use an orange 'Flex' cable. It can no longer be the standard 'white' wiring. It's too rigid. Also make sure you get the electrician to put in a safety circuit breaker.
I agree with the folding solar panel as well. Saves weight. Also look at installing a good quality charger as well as a DC to Dc charger with the 12 volt system.
It is my experience that weight is your killer. Try and reduce the weight wherever you can. One way is too replace all the glass windows with perspex. Someone posted that the glass window was 9.3kg and after putting in the perspex it came down to around 3kg. Thats a huge saving.
Also, before you install the inside lining make sure you haven't forgotten anything. So much easier to install say a powerpoint in now rather than regretting not installing one later. Been there done that. lol
I would also install insulation as well. A 25mm polystyrene foam is what I used.
And have a great time in renovating...
|
|
|
|
Post by snoops on Mar 7, 2019 17:13:10 GMT 10
What standard says you can’t use TPS in a caravan? The white exterior of the TPS cable is designed to prevent chewing by rodents whereas some orange circ is not. I would have no issues with the flexibility of normal TPS - once it’s in, it’s in and won’t be an issue, just like the original wiring isn’t. A caravan doesn’t present vibration issues like a car does, just a bit of bouncing around which is no issues. I’d run a meggar over it first - the wiring in my 69 Viscount is fine and still in use. Sorry, but as a Qualified Electrician I’m not sure I’d even pass an installation done in orange circ. I’m sure some would, but I’d prefer TPS myself. Just my 2 cents, not saying you couldn’t or shouldn’t use it, but that’s just me. All new vans I’ve seen use TPS down here in Vic - maybe a state based thing?
|
|
|
|
Post by bogwot on Mar 7, 2019 19:09:10 GMT 10
What standard says you can’t use TPS in a caravan? The white exterior of the TPS cable is designed to prevent chewing by rodents whereas some orange circ is not. I would have no issues with the flexibility of normal TPS - once it’s in, it’s in and won’t be an issue, just like the original wiring isn’t. A caravan doesn’t present vibration issues like a car does, just a bit of bouncing around which is no issues. I’d run a meggar over it first - the wiring in my 69 Viscount is fine and still in use. Sorry, but as a Qualified Electrician I’m not sure I’d even pass an installation done in orange circ. I’m sure some would, but I’d prefer TPS myself. Just my 2 cents, not saying you couldn’t or shouldn’t use it, but that’s just me. All new vans I’ve seen use TPS down here in Vic - maybe a state based thing? Perhaps it is a state thing. Its just what I was told by a caravan repairer here in Qld. |
|
|
|
Post by grandad on Mar 8, 2019 9:59:19 GMT 10
What standard says you can’t use TPS in a caravan? The white exterior of the TPS cable is designed to prevent chewing by rodents whereas some orange circ is not. I would have no issues with the flexibility of normal TPS - once it’s in, it’s in and won’t be an issue, just like the original wiring isn’t. A caravan doesn’t present vibration issues like a car does, just a bit of bouncing around which is no issues. I’d run a meggar over it first - the wiring in my 69 Viscount is fine and still in use. Sorry, but as a Qualified Electrician I’m not sure I’d even pass an installation done in orange circ. I’m sure some would, but I’d prefer TPS myself. Just my 2 cents, not saying you couldn’t or shouldn’t use it, but that’s just me. All new vans I’ve seen use TPS down here in Vic - maybe a state based thing? Thank you for that Snoops. I admit to having a mild OMG moment when I read the original post as rewiring everything at this point would involve a major rebuild of what I have accomplished so far. Almost to the point of tear it all down and start again. I have standard 3 core 2.4mm2 cabling inside conduit buried deep inside the wall of my Franklin. I'm so glad I can leave it all there. As an aside..... What does TPS stand for? Jim |
|
|
|
Post by Mustang on Mar 8, 2019 13:46:35 GMT 10
What standard says you can’t use TPS in a caravan? The white exterior of the TPS cable is designed to prevent chewing by rodents whereas some orange circ is not. I would have no issues with the flexibility of normal TPS - once it’s in, it’s in and won’t be an issue, just like the original wiring isn’t. A caravan doesn’t present vibration issues like a car does, just a bit of bouncing around which is no issues. I’d run a meggar over it first - the wiring in my 69 Viscount is fine and still in use. Sorry, but as a Qualified Electrician I’m not sure I’d even pass an installation done in orange circ. I’m sure some would, but I’d prefer TPS myself. Just my 2 cents, not saying you couldn’t or shouldn’t use it, but that’s just me. All new vans I’ve seen use TPS down here in Vic - maybe a state based thing? Thank you for that Snoops. I admit to having a mild OMG moment when I read the original post as rewiring everything at this point would involve a major rebuild of what I have accomplished so far. Almost to the point of tear it all down and start again. I have standard 3 core 2.4mm2 cabling inside conduit buried deep inside the wall of my Franklin. I'm so glad I can leave it all there. As an aside..... What does TPS stand for? Jim Thermoplastic-sheathed cable. |
|
|
|
Post by pisces51 on Mar 8, 2019 14:09:35 GMT 10
edit: Mustang has beat me to it. 
I cheated and used Google ... "Thermoplastic-sheathed cable (TPS) consists of an outer toughened sheath of polyvinyl chloride (PVC) (the thermoplastic element) covering one or more individual cables which are PVC insulated annealed copper conductors."
------------------------------------------------
I've always thought caravans had to use the multi-stranded 240V cable rather than the single-core cable (ie. each of the three cores in the cable are multi-strand, rather than a single strand). Can't remember where I got that info from, but apparently the multi-stranded copper wiring can withstand more flexing than a single strand. Is this true??
In NSW, 240V power cable for houses has to be 2.5 sq.mm cross-sectional area, and 240V lighting cable has to be 1.5 sq.mm cross-sectional area (the size of the actual copper wiring). Most extension leads for caravans have only 1.3 sq.mm wiring in them. If that's the sort of orange cable being used in a van, it wouldn't meet the NSW standard.
cheers, Al.
|
|
|
|
Post by snoops on Mar 8, 2019 16:54:42 GMT 10
What standard says you can’t use TPS in a caravan? The white exterior of the TPS cable is designed to prevent chewing by rodents whereas some orange circ is not. I would have no issues with the flexibility of normal TPS - once it’s in, it’s in and won’t be an issue, just like the original wiring isn’t. A caravan doesn’t present vibration issues like a car does, just a bit of bouncing around which is no issues. I’d run a meggar over it first - the wiring in my 69 Viscount is fine and still in use. Sorry, but as a Qualified Electrician I’m not sure I’d even pass an installation done in orange circ. I’m sure some would, but I’d prefer TPS myself. Just my 2 cents, not saying you couldn’t or shouldn’t use it, but that’s just me. All new vans I’ve seen use TPS down here in Vic - maybe a state based thing? Perhaps it is a state thing. Its just what I was told by a caravan repairer here in Qld. All good mate, you could be right - Qld require an Electrical safety certificate or something for vans when registering them I think, so probably some different stuff going on. |
|
greyjac
Newbie
Family of 6 looking for affordable adventures!
Posts: 9
|
Post by greyjac on Mar 16, 2019 16:30:23 GMT 10
Thank you Everybody, I assume I just keep posting questions and updates on this same thread?
We've all been sick and not much progress made this last week or so.
My next question is about windows... ah! I'll attach a few photos.... we are tossing up whether to replace with new frames etc... or restore and replace the perspex (rubbers, seals, etc.). All the windows are currently perspex... unsure if this is original or not? Anyway they're a bit cracked, a bit opaque/hazy. Mostly the frames look ok but would have to replace all hardware as its weathered. Some frames slightly bent.
Have a look and give us some advice- should we replace with new? if so where from? size on the kerbside windows is appts 590cm x 790cm. The Camec windows i looked at don't seem to come in these sizes.
If we go restore option... how much approx in perspex and fittings do you estimate?
|
|
greyjac
Newbie
Family of 6 looking for affordable adventures!
Posts: 9
|
Post by greyjac on Mar 16, 2019 16:35:30 GMT 10
|
|
greyjac
Newbie
Family of 6 looking for affordable adventures!
Posts: 9
|
Post by greyjac on Mar 16, 2019 16:38:50 GMT 10
ps, if anyone is on Instagram, you can follow our progress @charlieviscountvan (He came with the name Charlie when we bought him)
|
|
|
|
Post by Mustang on Mar 16, 2019 17:57:58 GMT 10
No Way i would replace with new, it would destroy the whole image of you van. I sourced sealing rubber for the inner & outer from local glaziers, it takes some searching but its out there, also Caravans Plus have older rubber profiles, you can order a sample package, also Ken Ellis from Vintage Caravan supplies. We used a 3mm plastic that is UV guaranteed for 10 years instead of glass & estimated a weight saving of 200 kg, yes that much we had 17 windows. I spent $750 on all windows including the curved corners.  |
|
greyjac
Newbie
Family of 6 looking for affordable adventures!
Posts: 9
|
Post by greyjac on Mar 16, 2019 21:27:53 GMT 10
Brilliant. I agree Mustang, it would change the look of the van too much. The people we bought it off said they had planned on replacing with new and I thought that meant you could buy new replicas of the same. Seems not!
We’ve decided on a polycarbonate to replace window panes with, and I’ve heard putting a scotch brite pad on your wire brush drill attachment makes the frames nice and shiny new again. .
Today we converted surface rust on the chassis with Ranex (brilliant stuff!!) . Tomorrow we paint the chassis.
|
|
|
|
Post by Mustang on Mar 18, 2019 8:28:44 GMT 10
How to Polish Tarnished Grooved Aluminum Windows
There's not a product, brush, potion that I haven’t tried to rejuvenate old aluminum, I’m yet to find anything that works, better than this method: (I’ve removed, polished replaced, over 30 x windows to date) Best method I have found for polishing grooved tarnished aluminum: (Non Oxidized)
1) Course steel wool , (pending condition) sprayed with INOX (pending condition) (WD40 is too light & dries out quickly) With this first step it is important to remove all lumps of tarnish, cavities from heavy tarnish are best left as part of the history. 2) Medium steel wool (any tarnished condition) 3) Fine " " " " “ Steel Wool is cheap, it wears out, change your pad when it balls up. You should have reached a semi shine by the “fine” stage, if not you may have skimped on stages 1 & 2. Now the secret is to finish with steel wool 0000 still saturated in INOX. Rub like no tomorrow, then de-grease the Inox. Next StepI have tried Purple de-Oxidizer, Purple Polish, White bull bar shine, most others.... I now recommend AUTOSOL, or the USA made NUSHINE apply after all of above, cheap & it works, However once you achieve a shine, maintenance with Purple de-Oxidizer followed by Purple Polish will give you a slightly higher gloss. It takes time, you cannot rush it, set small targets.
All by hand polish link linkPS: Mechanical brushes will give you quick result but, the surface will re-dull quickly. |
|
greyjac
Newbie
Family of 6 looking for affordable adventures!
Posts: 9
|
Post by greyjac on Mar 19, 2019 10:39:35 GMT 10
Thanks, I'm feeling really overwhelmed by the window thing! Slow and steady. We can forget going away at Easter, we've stripped Charlie back too far now for that :/
Side note, why are wheel arches so hard to come by?! Well, the ones you actually need with the side walls. Seems easy enough to find the ones that just run over the top, but doesn't every single van need side walls on their arches to stop the dirt and dust and water getting into their van? We can't fathom why the spares we're seeing are not made that way. We've had a steel fabricating friend come out today and take the old plastic ones home with him to model off. What has everyone else done when replacing wheel arches>?
|
|
|
|
Post by Mustang on Mar 20, 2019 17:27:15 GMT 10
I just had a look at my favorites, you are so correct, none out there?  So you have done the right thing with your friend, one thing, you know they will fit. |
|
|
|
Post by Husky on Mar 20, 2019 22:36:21 GMT 10
Hey GreyJac, I haven't been on for a while so just caught up on your thread. First up, welcome to the forum I'll follow along your build with interest as im neck deep in a ground up rebuild of a viscount called Charlie myself. Just back tracking a bit with your wiring delema and for everyone else commenting there are certain requirements and copies of certifications to be presented for both gas and electrical in some states of Australia when looking at registering and or insuring your van. it is best to ring around a few places and suss it out before jumping in both feet. Victoria is neither for either so no certifications required for rego or insurance so long as you don't say "Hey i did all the electrical's myself" i don't think they would insure you without having it checked.  Believe me some people aren't that bright.
From personal experience too, as my dad was an "A grade sparky" he insisted we use the orange 240 volt cable (not orange extension lead cable) in the scenic and then sat back and chuckled to himself as i tried to rough it in. OMG what a nightmare to work with in tight spaces or wrapping it around corners within the 25mm frame as you have in this van GreyJac. If you're in vic, go with the TPS cable it will make your life a whole lot easier if you rough it in yourself. even if i was in a state where the other was required i'd still go with TPS.
Have fun
|
|
greyjac
Newbie
Family of 6 looking for affordable adventures!
Posts: 9
|
Post by greyjac on Mar 24, 2019 21:31:10 GMT 10
Thanks heaps Husky! I'll check out your builds too. Ok.. this might be re-hashing old threads.. but I need people's genuine advice for fridge selection. situation: -Love the free camping life -Will have fairly decent solar setup -Don't have the budget for a new Thetford, Dometic... etc! Geez them things are pricey. after all my research i feel like I'm going around in circles... the kids will be sleeping right next to the fridge inside the van so that's the only thing that makes me hesitate with the gas, even though we'd make every effort to do it safely. So compressor, 2 way?? Or... |
|
|
|
Post by Mustang on Mar 25, 2019 7:40:01 GMT 10
I had a compressor in my previous modern Vitrifigo, sod of thing would run for 30 min in every hour, many sleepless nights as it cut in & out, the power hungry thing would still run our two 120 amp hour batteries continually down if it wasn't sunny all day.
In our current modern we have a 3 x way Thetford, aahhhh heaven!!! the new technology is marvelous, totally silent & efficient.
Fit a gas alarm if you are worried about leakage ($50) With kids the last thing you want when you are away is a sluggish second hand fridge, bend the bucks & buy new, it will be worth the peace & mind.
Saying the above our Walden came with a fairly new 2x way Waeco, seems very efficient without releasing much heat, but it really is a 1x way at 240v we will only run it on battery while travelling.
|
|
|
|
Post by snoops on Mar 25, 2019 9:45:15 GMT 10
Thanks heaps Husky! I'll check out your builds too. Ok.. this might be re-hashing old threads.. but I need people's genuine advice for fridge selection. situation: -Love the free camping life -Will have fairly decent solar setup -Don't have the budget for a new Thetford, Dometic... etc! Geez them things are pricey. after all my research i feel like I'm going around in circles... the kids will be sleeping right next to the fridge inside the van so that's the only thing that makes me hesitate with the gas, even though we'd make every effort to do it safely. So compressor, 2 way?? Or... I ditched the 2 way in my Viscount as I’ve found owning a few gas fridges of older vintages that they 1 - heat the van up too much, even with decent venting, fans, etc and 2 - didn’t keep my beer cold enough on a hot day - again, with extra venting, fans, etc so when I ended up with one of these - www.engelaustralia.com.au/2products_details_pid_24_productid_21415.htmlThis unit is designed to replace the small 2 and 3 way fridges in vans - it fit straight in on my ‘69 Viscount. It sounds like your budget may not stretch this far, but if it can I would highly recommend it. It auto switches between 240 and 12 volts but I’ve found I don’t even plug my van into the mains at home - I leave the fridge on 24/7/365 running off the batteries and solar setup - it never gives my batteries any dramas and it draws sod all current when running - less than my 15 year old Engel 40 litre. If I was being super critical the only downside would be it does make more noise than a gas fridge as it runs a compressor but with a bit of rubber under each corner, you really need to listen out for it, but thought I’d mention this as all compressor fridges will make some noise compared to the virtually silent gas units. |
|
|
|
Post by Mustang on Mar 26, 2019 7:58:34 GMT 10
Hi Snoops,
Interesting how the new fridges can run on 12v, without the engine running.
When I tested our newish Waeco you could see the battery going backwards by the second, I doubt it would have lasted the hour, fridges are certainly improved.
|
|
Believe me some people aren't that bright.