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Post by doublechevron on Jul 22, 2015 13:35:55 GMT 10
One rivet is a good way of doing it. It'll allow the frame to "move" as the caravan moves along the road. If it's solidly welded or riveted in a number of places to solidly lock the rhs tubing together .... it'll fatigue crack rather than flex/move  .......... At least that's my theory on why they have lasted so long! That rotten old caravan dismantled in the thread I mention has what appears to be a brand new frame in it. If it was wooden framed there would have been nothing left! seeya, Shane L. |
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Post by doublechevron on Jul 22, 2015 13:17:43 GMT 10
Well I drilled all the pop rivets out of that window cover.  As soon as you remove the big hinge across the top it all falls apart. It's incredibly flimsy one apart.  It's been repaired numerious times over the years (given the caravan still has it's original unworn cross plies on it I'd say this sucker fell off and popped apart every time the caravan was moved). I removed the silicon that must have been trying to hold it together as well.  with the top hinge off it "opens" along the top edge. the rubber seal is all that holds the edge of the aluminium into the frame. The seal looks like a long length of window wiper blade rubber.  Look how old the cracks in it are.... I'd say this happened when the caravan was new.    To straigten out the bend edges where it's popped out of the frame I used to pieces of very soft pine to spread the force and avoid further damaging the surface.   It's just sitting together here ... What I'll do is give it a really good clean and rivet it all back together and refit the seal. If it looks reasonable I'll coat the back of it with sikalfex adhesive, that way the panel can never blow out again (though given it will now be screwed to the caravan frame rather than the cladding, it's unlikely it'll twist/fall off allowing the big cover to twist along it's length now....it's the twisting along it's length as it's mounting screws fall out that will have allowed the cover to pop out of it's frame). seeya, Shane L. |
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Post by doublechevron on Jul 22, 2015 13:07:01 GMT 10
I can't find the thread, but one of the caravans in teh last few months in "hall of fame" is an aluminium framed 'van lifted off to expose/repair the chassis. You should be able to see there. They are just pop riveted together.
seeya
Shane L.
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Post by doublechevron on Jul 21, 2015 9:55:13 GMT 10
You guys are probably right with regards to the lifespan of fasteners. I still don't think there will be an issue. Every fastener gets a coat of silicon before it's screwed in, so it'll be isolated from the air and dissimilar metals either way ...
seeya,
Shane L.
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Post by doublechevron on Jul 20, 2015 17:11:23 GMT 10
Remember guys stainless steel of the 316 grade (the qualities you are thinking of) is very different to 302, 304, 304L, and carpenter class 305. The cheapest replacement slot head ones are about 0.28c ea if i buy at least 100, box is 1000! Depends if you are after 20 year or 50 year perfectionist results. only really done by isolating stainless from any contact with alloy, regardless of grade. I'm not overly fussed. The caravan doesn't live in salty water so I imagine the screws and aluminium cladding will outlive the caravan seeya, Shane L. |
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Post by doublechevron on Jul 20, 2015 14:42:07 GMT 10
I can't believe the difference in price from a specialty store (I have recently discovered locally) I bought a decent amount & it tallied to $40. When I queried the price, the guy thought I was on the negative,woe, woe, "no I mean you are SO CHEAP! I had been buying packs of 4 in a blister pack from you know who, & I reckon there is a hundred dollars worth on the counter, in comparison". The assistant really puffed his chest out. The margin in those blister packs must be enormous ? I am also loving the link you posted Shane. I must admit when I read about you replacing all the screws with stainless ones my first thought was 'I really need to do that too'. My second thought was 'how on earth can I keep costs down when I insist on being a perfectionist!' haha I can spend an hour in the screw section at you know where trying to work out the best combo to solve a problem. This link will save time and money! I'm not a perfectionist ... I'm a cheap skate So it's easy for me. You round a lot of the screws out trying to remove them (at least I do). They are also surprisingly rusty in the heads. They appear to have been "black coated" to match all the windows when new. The black coating lifted allowing them to rust. The tru-mold seal screws are still like new but are normal galvanised screws not "black" coloured (other than the ones I rounded out trying to remove). If I'm replacing them ............... You'd be crazy to use anything other than stainless when you can source them at a very reasonable price. So there is going to be shiny "dots" all around the black windows highlighting rather than hiding the screws. I can live with that seeya, Shane L. |
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Post by doublechevron on Jul 20, 2015 13:29:07 GMT 10
Nice to get some good news, re- no gunk in the front. What is the make of your uncles van?  I can't remember the name. It also leaked like a sieve from day one. It would be 8years old now I guess, and he's recently had to remove the front and back walls and replace them. He found they hadn't framed the windows correctly, that's why they couldn't get them leak free. The caravan I'm tidying up at the moment is VERY good compared to some of the modern caravans for sale. My brother spent quite a few months driving all over the place looking at cheaper rotten junk (ie: 10 -> $20k mark).... so slowly increased his price range until he was looking at ~ $30,000 caravans.... and then drove all over the place looking at very pretty, but still rotten junk. He's in the process of importing a pommy 'van now. At least it shouldn't leak ...  ? .... Maybe. He did have a very good locally made coromal. Independent suspension, full aluminium frame, no leaks .... I wouldn't even look at a wooden framed 'van in the future. seeya, Shane L. |
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Post by doublechevron on Jul 19, 2015 14:17:42 GMT 10
  Yep, I could just lift the staples up at the top of the window frame to access above it. The frame appears to be as good as it was the day it left the factory.  See the screw hole for the window cover. You can see there's nothing behind it.  3length of wood cut to the exact size to slot into the frame. I'll just glue it into position. The outside 2 screws I can't do anything about. The other 8 screws will hold it on fine. You know there is quite a few stone impact marks on the front window. So this cover has been an issue and abviously left unfitted from new (just "kind of" ) screwed back on when it was sold so it looked right. It would never survive being towed down the road. I'll fix the front cover itself before it's refitted.  all the repairs have been coated with a polyurethane varnish.... You know, given how perfect the frame is... I'm not concerned either way. It obviously never gets condensation in the wall cavities. seeya, Shane L. |
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Post by doublechevron on Jul 18, 2015 20:02:05 GMT 10
well that's intersting. I removed the front window cover today so cleaning around the window was easier.  I was amused to find half of the screws missing .... and several different types of screw in place... which is a new one. Nothing else has been touched on this caravan. It's made life very easy 'cos nothing has been messed with or butchered in the past.  You can see why the silicon was put over the front window cover rather than around the window now.... you can't get to the top of the window... so whoever pumped the silicon on tried ot seal the window cover.... Heres the "fun" bit ... the reason for the missing fasteners and odd sized screws There's nothing behind there... they forgot to put a bit of timber above the window frame at the factory so the window cover is "trying" to stay attached by screwing to the aluminium cladding. I'll have to try and remove the staples holding the cladding on and feed a length of timber up into there so there is something for the window cover to screw too. It could be worse, with my uncles new caravan they "forgot" to put the frame in to screw the rollout awning too... SO it fell off when the caravan was still new. seeya, Shane L. seeya, Shane L. |
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Post by doublechevron on Jul 17, 2015 9:59:32 GMT 10
I probably should go upto the local specialty store too .... It's just so easy to sit there and sort through the various options in the ebay shop though ... ... I hate wasting time trying to make a decision at a store while there is a queue of people lined up behind me (especially if they go to all the effort of finding the stuff I want, then I find it's about several times the cost I was expecting).
You know, to reseal a simple window I've worked out it'll take upto 5hours a window:
1/2hour to remove window
1hour to pull the seals, clean off any silicon pumped over the thing over the years and refit the seals
1hour to chisel off the old mastic
another hour to clean the remains of the mastic off and get the window prep'd for new mastic
1 hour to clean the window surround on the caravan of silicon on mastic.
Not forgetting the 10minutes involved in adding new mastic and screwing the window back in.
seeya,
Shane L.
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Post by doublechevron on Jul 15, 2015 14:44:51 GMT 10
Looks like you are making good progress. Im in a similar world of pain but considering i'll be planning to keep this van for a number of years at least I know it will be done right! Good luck with the clean up/reinstall. Will be interested to see the technique you end up going with. The actually sealing up is the relatively painless last step that doesn't take a lot of time. caravansplus.com.au/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=204This for all the windows, with foam tape around the window edge to protect the mastic from the weather. Last time I got the foam tape from bunnings. 12mm is the thinnest from caravansplus. think I used about 6mm x 3mm closed cell cell foam tape from memory last time. There is very large gaps around the slide windows in this. So it will probably be at least a tube of mastic for each window ... and probably two for each 4seasons hatch. The Jmold seals and vents I will just use a quality brand white roof and plumbers silicon on. If done right it will last the life of the caravan and hopefully never need to be removed in the future (that's why the mastic is used on the windows, to allow for simple removal in the future). I'll need to buy in some stainless steel screws to replace every screw I have removed too. stores.ebay.com.au/fastenerkitsonline/I think I purchased from here last time. VERY reasonable prices for smaller quantities of stainless fasteners. seeya, Shane L. |
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Post by doublechevron on Jul 13, 2015 17:04:32 GMT 10
If you are having trouble with the timing of a Singer sewing machine, The Early Singer Sewing Machines have a shorter needle than later Singer machines, Check on the net using the Sewing Machine Model number for the correct needle. Rattles Oh man that makes too much sense. I couldn't see where the issue was by looking at it ... and didn't want to adjust anything when it obviously worked in the past (the guy I bought it from couldn't get it to work right, even though he swore the guy that he bought it from used to make his own sails with it). seeya, Shane L. |
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Post by doublechevron on Jul 13, 2015 15:28:26 GMT 10
Proper "heat exchangers" most likely fail in the caravan as unlike the air space in a house room the heat does not have enough height and separation to the intake. When you have exterior air intake then anything greater than 10-20% mix requires a lot more energy to stay cool. Car aircon with fresh air V recirculated air setting is a good example. Note how big the water puddle is under cars with air con, so external drain a must. otherwise it soon becomes a badly designed evaporator air con in function. I'd fit something like this ... www.ebay.com.au/itm/New-Ayre-Air-Conditioner-Split-System-Reverse-Cycle-Still-in-Box-/161756212565?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_15&hash=item25a96bed55Anything that's an inverter that has < 10amp startup requirements would be perfect. That way you could run it from a 2kw generator if required. The trick would be installing it without damaging anything inside the caravan. most roof units seem to be very heavy and inefficient. I hate the idea of all the weight being up high... not to mention the expensive and extra height requirements too. The split systems are pretty simple to install yourself too. seeya, Shane L. |
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Post by doublechevron on Jul 13, 2015 14:00:07 GMT 10
I highly recommend using a $15-25 fan from Coles Woolies, if you have 240V. In humid hot zones the dryer warm air that comes in from vents helps dry out inhabitants and feels cooler. IMO using those evaporator style things is a recipie for creating a mould farm. Highly recommended is going somewhere less humid, like South Aussie or WA in the really bad months! There not evaporative coolers. There proper reverse cycle air conditioners. There may be some good ones out there. But the one I tried was useless. I'm probably going to fit a domestic split system to my caravan and mount the consdensor unit on the drawbar (if I bother with A/C that is ). seeya, Shane L. |
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Post by doublechevron on Jul 13, 2015 13:27:06 GMT 10
I've got a 3 kW Mobile Air Conditioner which I'll incorporate into the Van somewhere. I have to decide on an interior layout first. Probably two singles beds at the back & a double at the front over the table. Electric Bar Fridge, Microwave & one of those two burner Grills. 24" Flat Screen & an Aldi DVD. I don't think I'll worry about top storage. Any way I see how it all progresses. I'm putting the floor back on the Chassis tomorrow. There is a little water damage around a couple of the edges on the flooring but not bad enough to worry about. A little bog should fix it. I put a mobile A/C in our Milard and it doesn't work all that well. I think the main problem is it draws the air from within the van. I put 2 exhaust holes in to expell the hot air. 1 at both ends of the van for sleeping and for eating. But it just sucked warm air for the outside as it creates a vacuum within. But it ws better than nothing. I tried a portable air conditioner at the beach last year. It did blow a nice breeze of cold air. However it was noisy and generated more heat that coolness. The amount of heat they generate into the area being cooled seems to far outweigh any "cooling" they generate. They are a hell of a water pump though. You need to sit them up high and put a big bucket under there drain. Basically, there bloody useless IMO I've got a mate who lives up in QLD that tried on in a small bedroom. He found it made lots of noise, created lots of water... he left it running there all afternoon and recorded no temperature drop in the room. The following day he did the same thing without the A/C running and found the room stayed slightly cooler...... seeya, shane L. |
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Post by doublechevron on Jul 13, 2015 13:18:14 GMT 10
I had a similar chat with Locky about the logistics of making "Retro" caravans, i do not think anyone has delusions about getting a classic or vintage from them, in many ways no different to getting a Shelby Cobra replica.Value & enjoyment for a price point. Using solvent to expand the sillycone off, without damaging what it is glued to, takes a fraction of the time brushing it off does. Wipe- do something else, wipe again- do something else then peel. Soak any stubbon bits- do something else- remove and move on. I can not see anywhere only charging out @%50ph staying around with current running costs. Your Singer looked like a sailmakers style i have seen in many places, makes sence as lightweight fabrics only. They always have a beast somewhere for the chunky and canvas work. That singer would have been a dress makers machine I'd say .... The guy that sold sold it to me had modified the pulley to slow it down. I can simply unbolt his extra pulley .... He warned me it would stitch me from fingertip to shoulder quicker than I could say "merde" if I did that. It was used by a guy to make his own sails prior to me. This is the other machine I picked up. These old singers are worth nothing. This one looks well used, but I can't find any evidence of wear or slop in it anywhere. Look how huge the zigzag mechanism is on it.  I just need to get the timing on the bobbin right and it'll be away. I'm try to retrim my DS21 myself if I ever have the time and money. seeya, Shane L. |
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Post by doublechevron on Jul 13, 2015 11:47:01 GMT 10
My thoughts are with you about silicone, recently I was physically buggered just trying to remove a large window, covered with the goop. You have the right idea for your reno, progressing well. When I see a reno performed in a short time there has to be a lot of this crud left behind. Love that sewing machine, I do leatherwork & have been promising myself a commercial machine one day? That machine isn't a leather one, it's a light indudustrial singer. Though I have used it to retrim a car in vinyl. Which actually turned out surpringly good given it was my first attempt at sewing. I also picked up a medium duty machine that can be used for canvas and leather. But it needs the timing of the lower bobbin setup correctly as it doesn't sew properly. Another "oneday" task .... There's so much stuff I'm "gonna oneday" do  . I look at this caravan and don't understand how any caravan repairer could reseal an older caravan for any amount less than the current market value of the caravan given the sheer time involved. You could easily spend two 38hour hour work weeks solid stripping the old sealer away and re-assembling with new sealant. Especially if it's had, er, "not smart" people pump silicon all over the place over the years. That's 38 x 2 x $50 an hour...... easily $3800 in labour alone. To do it for any less they would have to be cutting corners everywhere. seeya, Shane L. |
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Post by doublechevron on Jul 12, 2015 12:33:47 GMT 10
The cladding on this caravan is in quite good condition.... So annoyingly I found it was still very easy to scratch trying to get the window surrounds clean enough.  taping it up seemed to work ok though.   The tool of choice. The mastic scrapes off quite easy .... silicon is evil, evil nuts you'll waste hours of your life trying to remove though   I don't mind scratching it at all.... it'll key the surface very well to be resealed.  REMOVE MASKING TAPE IMMEDIATELY. If you reckon silicon sucks to remove... just try removing tape that's been in place to long.  while I have the electric screwdriver in hand .... yep, that would have leaked.  that would have leaked too.   Yep I reckon they would all leak... look at that concrete mastic. What's the deal with that big microwave vent? Surely microwaves weren't a factory fit in 1985? It matches all the other vents though ( Note: it's not fitted square if you look closing LOL ). Yes all those vents will need to come up to be re-sealed. so will the outside light.  Look at that ... the mastic in the door frame is falling away. It'll have to come out too.  To big fridge vents..... and the bloody aftermarket aeriel .... Every caravan I've ever seen one of these INTERNAL DOMESTIC tv housing has bloody leaked.  This one is no different. It's hard to see due to the pattern in the plywood. This is the only water staining that I found when I bought the caravan (all the other staining being behind the open curtains). I wasn't concerned as there was no signs of any moisture damage in the cupboard under the fridge. which mean the water has only followed the tv line into the shelf there (I can also access it all from behind through those big fridge vents which I'll have to remove to reseal). I checked inside every cupboard and under bed/couch storage area inside this caravan for moisture damage before buying it. There was none. I know these photos show what seems to be a lot. But they have required dismantling of the caravan to find.    speaking about how evil silicon is to remove. Why do people do this ... at least it's only one coating ... not mutliple lots pumped one over the top of the last for years ( urrrghhhh ). A few old caravans I've looked at have had so much silicon pumped all over the windows you'd think the owners had owned shares in a silicon factory.   This is why pumping silicon all over the outside of the window frames will never work ..... look at all the dirt and mastic and crap behind it.  I've been amazed to find all the other window surrounds are perfect.... no moisture damage at all, even though the ply inside can show signs of moisture damage. I really did pull out the only bad window with that first one.   this is that silicon applied around the window from this side. As you can see it really will do bugger all.... Other than be evil stuff to try and remove from the caravan. seeya, Shan el. |
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Post by doublechevron on Jul 10, 2015 13:50:50 GMT 10
I dont think I've even seen one of those caraparks in the flesh. I see you point about olympics though. I've never found one of them anywhere though . I've also been tempted by the Chesney  In theory like you olympics these shouldn't be rotten. Aluminium frame and "overlapping" roof and end caps should in theory mean water can't get inside anywhere other than the windows (which won't matter so much with an aluminium frame) or roof hatches. seeya, Shane L. |
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Post by doublechevron on Jul 10, 2015 9:52:48 GMT 10
The thing is .... Are any of these old 'van you find worth tyring to drag home. I have NEVER looked at a tired old 'van that isn't so rotten it's even worth my effort dragging home (the only exception I'll add to that is that one Mick found .... that must 1 in a million). I've always liked the idea of an old franklin, but all the ones I've found to look at have been extensively rotten What amazes me is people still buy them. As most people on here are aware, a rotten old 'van will cost you thousands of hours and many times it's final value to restore. The trick is to find one that isn't rotten in the first instance and just "tidy it up" You will spend a LOT of time looking at rubbish to find the rare one worth towing home .... seeya, Shane L. |
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Post by doublechevron on Jul 8, 2015 14:42:35 GMT 10
I reno'd my first window about March & its still OK. Viewed an advert last week that Purple polish has produced a prep polish for aluminium, you then apply PP after using the prep, so I will give it ago when I see some. Shane L: Yes the window locks are unique to the series, they need to be secured under the fly screen, I would expect similar to later models, but later just don't fit? I will continue to use external turn buttons, untill I find one to copy. The hunt continues, I have an ad on the VV site. At the risk of a hijack, purple polish has to be the best product you can buy for polishing metal. I bought it for my heavily tarnished alloy bullbar after reading recommendations on the product by others on 4wd forums. Left other products for dead. I only recently bought their aluminium deoxidiser which you use before the purple polish for even more impressive results. Turned a 30 year old dull bullbar into something a little more presentable! I get both products shipped from qld. www.californiacustom.com.au/california-custom-catalogue/purple-metal-polishInteresting, I find the brushes are nothing short of brilliant for cleaning up gasket housings etc... (eg: water pumps, thermostat housings etc). Does that polish remove corrosion ? Dull is one thing, I'm used to brushing away pitted corrosion Anyone that's owned a car imported from the salty soggy UK will know what I mean by corrosion seeya, shane L. |
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Post by doublechevron on Jul 8, 2015 10:04:12 GMT 10
If you do a bit of work cleaning old aluminium. Especially car part. I have purchased a few of these. Excellent presents for anyone that tinkers with old cars/caravans/radios/etc... where cleaning of aluminium is required. www.machinerycleanery.com/They are hand made by a very smart person in Melbourne. Sadly I've managed to loose my brush again .... Damn it ... it'll be hiding down the back of a bench somewhere. If I have the money I'd buy 1 of each brush. They would last a lifetime. seeya, Shane L. |
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Post by doublechevron on Jul 7, 2015 9:53:21 GMT 10
They look absolutely spectacular .... How did you clean them up so well  That's amazing how much they tidy up the look of the caravan. seeya, Shane L. After using every power wheel, acids, preps, you name it I tried it. It all came back to elbow grease as the quickest most effective. Course, medium,fine steel wheel sprayed with Inox clean off the Inox, then Autosol metal polish. Porosity has been the enemy inside the frames, the exterior not so bad, possibly kept cleaner by rain. You are right with the head bruising Shane, I've copped a couple of beauties.  Hughdini: Still working on the locks, I have external fly screen turn buttons at the moment. They stay in place with no problems. If I can get my hands on a lock I will get it 3D printed. Excellent. I've cleaned up aluminium in the past by wet sanding the corrosion off down through finer grades of wet and dry paper. Then using the metal polish when it's level and unscratched. Sadly it dulls again very quickly. You need to keep polishing it to keep it shiny. (maybe applying car polish to it would protect the aluminium from dulling/oxidizing again). Are they a unique window lock? I would have thought you could purchase them readily given how frail and easily broken they are. To get it 3D printed you will need to get one scanned into electronic format first. One of the guys on the french car forum I'm on has a 3D printer and has been making small parts. Window locks would be perfect use for a 3D printer: www.aussiefrogs.com/forum/citro%EBn-forum/111105-dee-plastic-bits.htmlseeya, Shane L. |
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Post by doublechevron on Jul 6, 2015 20:25:01 GMT 10
They look absolutely spectacular .... How did you clean them up so well That's amazing how much they tidy up the look of the caravan. seeya, Shane L. |
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Post by doublechevron on Jul 4, 2015 13:31:13 GMT 10
Hi everyone, These windows were used because there was a shortage of wind out windows in the eighties,most people preferred wind out for the better security when locked,the fixed fly wires,the ease of opening and the biggest one of all,being able to be open in the rain! Also when a sliding window was open you were only getting half the airflow,which people up north complained about. I have owned a couple of these Windsors with those windows,and believe me I couldn't wait for wind outs to get back on track! The maker of these windows was MTM in Melbourne,but I believe they are no longer trading. Cheers hughdeani Better security ?? these are all metal with metal locks. you'll be right about air flow as only 1/2 the space is opened... I reckon these days none of this is relevant either way as caravans now have central heating and air conditioning .... and closed windows ......... I reckon these are brilliant 'cos no-one will bash there heads on them .... and they won't break! I like well made stuff designed not to break seeya, Shane L. |
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.......... At least that's my theory on why they have lasted so long! That rotten old caravan dismantled in the thread I mention has what appears to be a brand new frame in it. If it was wooden framed there would have been nothing left!
? .... Maybe. He did have a very good locally made coromal. Independent suspension, full aluminium frame, no leaks .... I wouldn't even look at a wooden framed 'van in the future.
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That's amazing how much they tidy up the look of the caravan.