1980 Viscount Executive Styline Deluxe - 4957

[Deleted]

Hi All,

I have been stalking this site for a couple of weeks checking out all that you have done to your vans and all I can say is WOW!!!! What a site & what helpful people to boot. We have recently purchased our first caravan. I think it is a 1978 model but the chassis number appears to have been shortened when they have modified the A frame. We bought our van knowing that it needed the front wall replaced due to wood rot, but having built our own home are not scared to roll up our sleeves and get busy doing the van up to make it our home away from home. We have been 'tenters' up until now but with 3 kids in tow were looking to an alternative that didn't involve needing a F250 to accommodate all our gear. We've decided since bringing the van home that we'll probably end up doing a full reno as time allows but for the moment would just like to repair the front wall to a usable condition so that we can head away for the school holidays in a couple of weeks. Hubby has been working on the van today but is scratching his head when it comes to removing the door from the caravan. There is a white plastic which is a 90 degree internal trim that locks into the door frame to cover the edge of the wall paneling. We're not really sure how to remove this (it appears to be glued in?) without breaking it into pieces. If anybody is able to offer some advice/know how when it comes to removing the door it would be greatly appreciated.

Cheers 
Sue

[ForumMod]

G'day scaley66, and welcome to the forum!

Firstly, I think you'll find your van is from the early 1980s - maybe 1980 to 1982. It won't be a 1978 model. It's got the cabin shape that Viscount changed to either during the latter part of, or just after, 1979. Often you'll see your type of van listed as the "Grand Tourer" model.

Secondly, the "Executive Styline Deluxe" tag was given to the van by a sales yard in Melbourne operated by Doug Thorley, who gave that same tag to all the vans he sold, no matter who originally built them. It was his way of putting his own 'Dealer stamp' on each van he sold (and forum member hughdeani can confirm if I'm telling the truth or not )

Thirdly, forum member youngdazza might be able to help with the door situation. He's got a 1984 Viscount Aerolite, so he might have the same door as you, and might know how they are fitted. It's quite possible that the doors on the Viscounts from the late 1970s are the same as yours as well, so let's see if anyone can shed a bit of light on the subject for you.

Fourthly, personal circumstances meant we ended up with a 1992 Windsor van for our current caravanning requirements (although I'm always on the lookout for a 1978/79 Viscount in very good condition ). I've had nothing but trouble with the front window leaking on our van during the two years we've had it. I've tried every way of sealing it, short of pulling the whole window out and trying to sort it out (but I don't have anywhere to store it under cover while I spend the time trying to do that). I ended up spitting the dummy during our last trip away, and pulled the window out when we got home and covered the opening up with some additional framework and stippled white cladding. Now I don't have a front window at all...but I also don't have any leaks in the front of the van anymore either. The main problem with the original window as I saw it was that because the window sloped backwards from bottom to top, it was difficult for any water to drain away easily when rain fell on the window (even with our window shield fitted). Mostly the water would build up on the window frame, and then find ways of overflowing back into the van, rather than flowing away from the window down the cladding. I think these wind-out windows are a poor design in the first place for water tightness, and having them on the sloping front of a van seems to be asking for trouble, I reckon. They can cause enough problems when they are vertical on the sides of a van, let alone when they are tilted backwards.

cheers,
Al.

[Deleted]

Thanks Al. Funnily enough there is a Doug Thorley sticker on the back of our van I Have wondered about the year but it was advertised as a 1978 when we bought it. Hours of searching and I've yet to find one the same but I think you're on the money that it's possibly early 80's. You really are the go to person for all things Viscount.

I'm curious about the window too. Without pulling the whole van apart (which we will do eventually) the only really obvious signs of rot are on the front wall and there seems to be a little on the side rear window. I'm looking forward to getting stuck into it, just need to work out this door! Hopefully someone will be able to shed some light on it (before hubby takes to it with the angle grinder...)

Cheers
Sue

[Deleted]

Hi Sue,
As Al says,I also think this is 1980 or newer.
This is an economy version of. viscount,made for the masses that wanted to get into caravanning at a budget price.Thats why ther are no wheel spats,wrap around windows,sliding overhead cupboards,thinner upholstery foam,smaller windows etc.
Nothing wrong with that though,still a great looking van you have there !
As to the door ,I don't understand the problem,door unscrews from the side frame with door open,don't need to touch internal plastic trim at all,then door and frame pull out in one piece(carefully)!
Please don't try and put more silicone around front window,if you do it properley from the outset you won't have problems again.Firstly buy some spray grease with a small tube on it,and open front windows fully.now put a flat blade under the remove able flywire where the wind out window boxes are and prise open till you can see a little hole.Spray some grease into the box until it's full,and another leaking problem is fixed,
Hope you can understand all that,even I get confused sometimes!
Cheers
Hughdeani

[Deleted]

Thank you Hughdeani, hubby did manage to get the door off this morning so one obstacle passed. Thanks for the info on the van, I'm hoping when we pull it apart a bit more we may find something on the walls to indicate correct year.

Great instructions re the window. We'll be doing our best to make the ol' girl as leak proof as possible so every bit of expertise helps!

Cheers
Sue

[Deleted]

Hi All,

The renovations have started on the van that has some confusion about it's year and it's name    She shall be known as Kerri from this point forward, after The Kerrigans from The Castle, cos we know it'll be a bit rough around the edges but this will be our holiday castle 

We knew the front wall had rot in it and was going to have to be completely removed, which of course has snowballed into many other parts of the van being removed. In 2 days we have managed to make a fair mess of what was once a half decent looking caravan. The good news is that any rot seems to be fairly well contained to the front wall, there is rust in the outside strip that runs along the the chassis around the door and on the opposite side to the wheel arch. Hubby has been busy with his angle grinder, renovator tool, & welder and has managed to get a good start on putting some stability back into the ol' girl. I've spent a few hours trying to remove the old mastic from some of the panels that have been removed so far & can see many many hours of this ahead of me yet... We've been excitedly looking at ideas as far as a slightly changed floor plan & I am happily researching options to make the ol' girl look new again & make the most of the space we have. We're probably looking at options that might make some 'classic caravanners' hair curl, but we're happy to be busy with a project we're excited about!

Just looking for some information with regard to supplies if anyone can help? We live in a rural area (Mildura, Vic) so suppliers are not plentiful. Does anyone have any good contacts as to where you can purchase online for reasonable prices. We're going to be needing nearly everything, internal panels, internal mouldings, J Mold (which I'm assuming from everything I've read is the stuff that goes around the exterior edge of the van). 

Will try and post updates as they are happening, hopefully I can remember to take pics as we go. Happy caravanning!

Cheers
Sue

[supreme78]

Welcome to the madness
The interior paneling is available from bunnings. It's called gunnersons rezielience wall paneling. It's available in a number of different colors. Look on the gunnersons website for colors. They also do the joining strips and corners ect in the same colors to go with the panels. They won't have any in stock but they can get it for you. I got mine from the local hardware. Home hardware to be exact but they had to order it from gunnersons.
Caravans plus have many caravan parts and post as required. They have a website store for dreaming of all the nice things you would like to add to your van so be carefull.
Good luck with your renovation.
Paul

[ForumMod]

G'day Sue, I've edited your post and transferred it over here to your original thread. Just keep adding any posts about your van to this thread, and it will keep all your story together. If you have any questions, or want further advice about your van, this thread is where you post them, as well as keeping us up to date with your progress.

You can also check out ebay for plywood deals. Look for polyester plywood. There's a seller in Somersby, Vic who sells sheets of plywood cheap, and will arrange freight.

And as supreme78 says, CaravansPlus is the place to shop for bits and pieces. You won't find everything to match your van, but you'll find a fair bit of stuff on their website.

Don't worry about your proposed modifications curling people's hair. There's been some quite outstanding changes made in some of the vans on this forum. A whole palace created on the inside, and disguised as an old '70s van on the outside. If you want to see what's possible, have a read of these threads:

No.1

No.2

No.3

And if you want to see one of the most amazing Viscount restorations ever, have a read of this thread: RocketRod's 1970's Viscount Reno

Go ahead - Match those!!

cheers,
Al.

[Deleted]

Thank you so much for your responses - I seriously looooove this forum & all the helpful people on it!

Paul, I've actually ordered some samples from Gunnersons, it's so hard trying to pick colours etc via a computer screen. Do they supply direct to the public or only via someone like Bunnings? We have a trip to Adelaide coming up in August for our daughter's specialist appointment so I'm hoping we might be able to find some time to go and check out places that we can physically see what's on offer. Any suggestions of places to check out by anyone would be hugely appreciated.

Al, OMG!!!!!! 1, 2, & 3 were awesome! RocketRod's was amaaaaaaaazing!!! I'm still trying to pick my jaw up off the floor I'm not sure whether to show hubby or not. I can see a bar going in the van & the kids sleeping in their swags outside We're considering changing the external structure of the van at the front by removing the curved bottom for a straight edge. Looking for a way to be able to insert a tiny bit more space to accommodate the family. Any thoughts on this? I did find a thread that had a similar sort of thing done here ditzygypsy.proboards.com/thread/1475/1975-capricorn-vogue and think it looks pretty good. We are also looking at maybe putting checker plate around the bottom section of the van, most of the pannelling is fairly ordinary anyway (especially after I've taken to it with my POWER tools, hehe)

Cheers
Sue

[Deleted]

G'day everyone! I have another question.... We've hunted high & low locally for some meranti and no-one here either stocks it or will order it in What do others suggest as an alternative to using this to rebuild the areas of the frame affected? Or is it one of those things where there really isn't a second best?

TIA
Sue

[ForumMod]

I personally don't see anything special about the meranti timber. It seems to be the "flavour of the month" for commercial caravan builders, but if you read some of the other caravan forums on the internet, you'll see people have had trouble with leaks in their vans and rotted meranti timber after only a few years. Once upon a time when I was a younger lad, pacific maple was all the go for building internal framework in houses where the finished product got coated with polyurethane coatings. The generation before that used oregon timber for framework. So, the popular timber species go in and out of fashion over time, due to the availability of supply.

Meranti probably just happens to be the timber that's readily available these days, so I'm surprised you are having trouble sourcing it. Maybe it too is starting to see the end of its era, and another timber species will take it's place. There has to be some sort of softwood timber that people can stain and polish to look pretty expensive in buildings, so there will always be a market for something or other.

I have a 60-year old timber caravan in my shed, and the framework around that van was made from radiata pine. Apart from the areas where water leaks have rotted the pine, the rest of the framework is still in very good condition. Radiata pine is cheap, and should be readily available in most hardware/timber places.

The bottom line is that if you seal your van correctly so there's no possibility of it ever leaking ever!, then it really doesn't matter what sort of timber you use for framework. Obviously you would choose a softwood over a hardwood due to weight considerations, but even that's not a sacrament (evidenced by the amount of chipboard timber used in some of these old caravans - that stuff weighs a tonne compared with plywood!)


With regards to changing the external structure of the van, go ahead if it suits your needs. If you read this thread, you'll see jrabs is changing the front and rear framework to eliminate the wrap-around windows (a common source of leaking). Anything is possible in these old vans, as long as you don't upset the original weight balance of the van too much (and by that I mean your changes don't shift too much weight to the front of the van or to the rear compared with how it was originally - you'll create towing nightmares if it gets out of whack too much).

cheers,
Al.

[Deleted]

Thanks Al. Apparently they've had a lot of trouble with the meranti warping (must be our beautiful Mildura climate) but the guy at the timber shop said they haven't stocked it for about 2 years. Looks like pine it is then & nothing like being able to save a few $$$ in the process Does the pine have to be treated or sealed at all? I have no idea when it comes to this, we built our own home but it's a steel frame so didn't have to worry about that side of things at all...

Hopefully the changes we plan to make won't upset the balance of the van. We're not messing around with the layout inside too much so fingers crossed it will even out with what we do.

Thanks again for all your help, it really is appreciated.
Sue

[ForumMod]

...had a lot of trouble with the meranti warping...

Yeah, I've heard of people having that problem as well. One of our members really struggled to find decent meranti in amongst their local Bunnings stock.

Pine is fine (I'm a poet ). You'll quickly educate yourself about the varying quality of some of the pine timber you see. Some of it has large knots in it that shouldn't end up in your crucial framework (the knots will split eventually). It's a matter of searching through the stack of pine timber, and picking out the bits that are nice and straight, and which don't have any really crappy sections along the length. Most of what you'll see in the stack is pretty good quality. If not, go elsewhere to another supplier who has much better quality stuff. The pine I see in my local Bunnings stores (we have 3 of them in our region) seems to pretty reasonable quality.

Does it need to be treated or sealed? No, not really. In some ways if you do that you are conceding that the van will leak again some time in the future. I'd prefer to see people on this forum think carefully about how the outside of their van is sealed, and to spend a fair bit of time and effort (and money, if necessary) to make sure the van "can't possibly" leak ever again. And I know that making a van absolutely 100% leakproof is probably me dreaming, but I do think that's where the big effort is required in these projects.

Hopefully you are also following some of the other current threads on the forum. A couple of recent projects I can think of that used pine timber for framework is this post for a seat box, and this post for the bed frame. There will probably be stacks of other projects on the forum that used pine timber, but you get the drift.

ps. if you built your own home (good for you! ) then you'll at least be aware that a lot of timber framed houses these days are built with pine frames and trusses, so that has to say something for the timber.

cheers,
Al.

[Deleted]

3 Bunnings!!! I'd be in heaven...and constantly broke

Sealing the van is my biggest concern, I'd hate to think we're going to all this effort to make the inside look nice & then not finish the job properly I've seen a couple of good posts regarding it so have saved them for future reference - I'm a bit of an over researcher, haha!

I think we found the source of the water entry in the front wall and it wasn't the window as we suspected it may be (although that may have contributed). There was a dent at the top of the wall which someone has obviously tried to panel beat out and there is a split along the bend of the paneling about 3 inches long Would it be possible to somehow fix this to seal it or would you advise to replace the paneling? Just trying to see if there is possibly a cheaper alternative but at the same time don't want to risk having it leak again.

Thanks for the links, I will check them out & no doubt be back with yet more questions

Cheers
Sue

[ForumMod]

I'm a bit of an over researcher, haha!

In this game you can never have too much knowledge.


A split in the cladding? No problem. This is one of the rare times where I advocate using a neutral cure silicone sealant (plumber's guttering sealant) on a caravan. Clean the underside surface around the crack to remove any dust/dirt; get the split closed as much as possible (ie. get both sides of the split to meet together as evenly as you can, by pushing and pressing lightly if necessary. You should be able to run your finger across the split from one side to the other, and not feel a significant step between the two sides. Coat that underside of the split with the neutral cure silicone sealant and aim to coat out to about 20mm all around the split. Make sure the sealant is making good contact with all of that surface. Use a kitchen knife or plastic spatula to "butter" the sealant so it's covering the area, and is a few millimetres thick all over. Leave to cure. Clean any tools up with turps before the sealant cures (which takes hours, so no hurry for cleaning).

Now the important bit: Have some mineral turps on hand, plus a roll of toilet paper. Take a few sheets of toilet paper and fold them into a square wad about 50mm x 50mm. Moisten the wad of toilet paper with the turps, and go up on the outside of the cladding where the split is, and gently wipe any sealant that's oozed through the split. Renew the pad as often as you have to (which will be often). Moisten each new pad. Keep wiping gently until you've removed any excess sealant from the outside surface of the cladding, and the cladding paintwork looks like it's back to being just paint again (you can tell if silicone is still there by looking at an angle). Go have a well-earned cup of tea with the money you've just saved. [Caution: only use turps to clean the surface of cladding. Metho will take the cladding paint off.]

Have a go. You'll realise how easy the whole process is, and the use of wads of toilet paper and turps will be good practice for the day when you start resealing the van.

cheers,
Al. 

[Deleted]

Jun 20, 2014 22:21:58 GMT 10 ForumMod said:

A split in the cladding? No problem. This is one of the rare times where I advocate using a neutral cure silicone sealant (plumber's guttering sealant) on a caravan.
cheers,
Al. 

Al, can you please explain or point me to where it explains the differences between sealants? I think I have used a neutral cure (non acid cure?) sealant inside my van, around the wiring where it goes through the framework, upon the advice of my electrician. I ran out and grabbed another one that I had on hand, and noticed that it smelt funny, turns out it was an acid cure one. That led me to googling the difference and I found some blog post where a guy said never to use acid cure sealant near aluminium, but the labelling on the packet says it's ok so he was confused I guess but that's left me pretty confused about it all!

As mentioned above, sealing my van is my most biggest and important job to protect all my hard work and I want to do it once, and right (am I dreaming haha?) So I need to get my head around sealants to make sure I am using the most appropriate one.
thanks
Karen

[Deleted]

Hi Sue, I am pretty new here and I am doing up (partially rebuilding) a Viscount Supreme 1978. It's quite a different shape to yours. Al has linked to my thread for a reference to building new seating out of pine (thanks Al, I feel pretty excited that my thread has some helpful links in it already!) I only have one local Bunnings but I should have shares in the place, one of the staff said to me the other day 'are you here again' and the paint counter lady knows my name

I'm using lots of 50 x 19 dressed pine, you can get it at Bunnings in precut lengths but I actually buy mine from Mitre 10 where you can buy it by the metre, it is about $1.50/m I think so pretty cheap but it is surprising how it disappears when you build framework (and cut pieces too short and have to do it again...lol...lots of kindling wood for the fire!) I've used it also for some extra framing in the walls of my caravan, it fits perfectly inside the channels of the aluminium framing.

The reason I chose that timber was because I like the look of it - I like the insides of my cupboards to look nice and didn't want to see chunky 4 x 2's in there. The 50x19 is a bigger dimension than what was there before so it must be a bit stronger which is good. It's not that heavy so hopefully I'm not adding unnecessary weight. And it's cheap and nice and easy to work with.

Good luck with your project, I will be watching with interest

cheers
Karen

[ForumMod]

...but the labelling on the packet says it's ok...

Really? That surprises me. I've always worked on the basis that acid-curing silicone should NEVER be used on metals due to the acetic acid in the sealant reacting with the metal (leading to possible corrosion). That's why plumbers who fix metal guttering together use a neutral cure silicone. Even if the guttering is Colorbond coated, wherever they make cuts in the guttering is exposing bare metal.

The cladding in your caravan might be coated on both sides. On the outside is the painted acrylic coating, and on the inside it might have a goldish appearance, which is a lacquer coating applied to the surface to protect it during manufacture and transport handling. Theoretically, the lacquer coating means you don't have bare metal there, but if there's a split in the cladding (or if holes are drilled into the cladding, etc) then bare metal is exposed.

See if this link works where you can download a pdf file of FAQs for silicone sealant: Sealant FAQs

cheers,
Al.

[Deleted]

That all sounds like fun Al, looks like I need to buy shares in dunny paper as well now. However, I think I'll forgo the cup of tea for something a li'l stronger (for medicinal purposes of course ), you know, just to help me get the job done... It is nice to know there is a cheaper way out though, and somewhere I can use silicone without getting into trouble  

Karen I've been reading your thread with interest. It's nice to see I'm not the only female who likes to pick up a power tool or two I can't wait to get to the stage where we can start building stuff rather than pulling it apart!

We have had the "Great Outdoor Expo" here this weekend so I popped along with the kids to have a look. Soooooo many vans with massive price tags attached. As nice as they are, they just don't have the quirkiness of the older ones and I was really surprised at how few of them seem to cater for families. It did get the cogs turning with regards to how I want the layout of our van, now I just need to get the ideas outta my head & on to paper. How hard can it be???

Cheers
Sue

[Deleted]

Eek ok Al I will double check the labelling again but anyway I freaked out when I read the blog saying not to use it and went and peeled if all off, it was still wet so I made quite a mess of my hands but got it off the van ok! Will read that link, thanks.

Sue I don't like the characterless new vans either, even if I had the $ to buy a new one I don't think I would. They are good for ideas though, layout as you say.

Cheers
Karen

[Deleted]

Can't find the packaging, must have chucked it out but I thought it said ok for use on metal. Definitely smelt vinegar like though so think it was acid cure? Anyway won't buy it again! Thanks Al for that link

[Deleted]

Sorry Al another question, why did you say to Sue that this is one of the rare times you suggest using a neutral cure silicon on a caravan? What should mostly be used?

[ForumMod]

this is one of the rare times you suggest using a neutral cure silicon on a caravan

Sorry, the emphasis should have been on the words silicone sealant, irrespective of what type it is. And the reason is along the lines of what you've just said about trying to remove it. It's ten times worse when the darn stuff has cured. This forum is full of people who have had to spend hours and hours trying to remove silicone sealant that some previous owner had plastered over the joins in their van. Probably a well-intended application of the stuff at the time, but it's the poor old restorer who gets stuck with trying to remove it.

What should mostly be used? Well, that discussion has gone on for a long time on this forum, and I don't think there's any clear answer yet. The main thread is this one: Silicone and other sealants
Deciding on what's best really comes down to being able to tell the future of the van you're restoring. If you'll never crack a window, or never get a leak, or never damage any cladding that will need replacing, then you could use silicone sealant, or any of the other polyurethane-type sealants that cure and can't be prised apart again easily. If you DO think there'll be times in the future where bits might have to be taken back off the van, then you have to choose from one of the sealants that actually can be prised apart again, which doesn't necessarily mean it's easy to do, only that at least it's possible to prise apart. The reason I advocated using a neutral cure silicone sealant on the split is because the owner is very unlikely to want to remove that silicone again in the future, and there's no doubt silicone is a cheap and effective way of sealing the crack defect.

The removable type of sealants are the ones that don't cure to a solid mass, but instead only skin over on the surface, while staying soft and pliable underneath. This type of sealant falls into the "mastic" group. You'll also sometimes hear/see/read the term "caulking compound", and these also are generally non-curing.

For windows and other fixtures around the outside of the van, other options besides sealants are the "closed-cell foam tapes" that are available. If you read this post in doublechevron's thread about his Chesney, you'll see how well foam tape has sealed the window in his van over the years. And apart from just using the tape, you can go one step further and use a combination of foam tape and a bead of sealant either on top of, or just beside, the tape, if you want to build in some extra insurance against leaking.

For the edge moulding around the body of the van (where the side cladding meets the roof cladding), you really need to use a sealant that gets pumped onto the cladding, and then when the moulding is pressed into position, the sealant is sort of 'forced' into shape and any excess is squeezed out the sides. That's the stage of the job where you end up thinking about and using the butyl mastic type sealants, or at least a type of sealant that can be pulled apart again.

We should talk more about this subject when you get to that stage, because there are ways of doing the sealing that makes the job easier to do and will create the least mess in the process.

cheers,
Al.

[ForumMod]

I meant to add in my post above that the Caravans Plus website has some very handy information about lots of things relating to caravans.

Click on the link for the main page on Caravan Articles, FAQ & Guides and then scroll down through all the headings.

For sealants and sealing caravans, click on this link: Sealing your Caravan or Motorhome

cheers,
Al.

[Deleted]

Thank you once again Al, you are so kind and generous to take the time to explain these things in a way that makes sense to a beginner like me. I imagine you've had to explain this stuff to countless others before me and I really appreciate your patience and knowledge, thank you.

I have read the sealants thread several times over the past month or so and whilst it makes a bit more sense to me each time, I cannot glean a clear answer from it, but I guess that's the thing, there's not one answer that fits all.

I will check those other links, but to save confusing myself further I won't make any decisions until I'm at that stage and I would love to pick your brains more then. All I need to know for now is not to slather my van in silicone sealant! (And keep away from the acid cure stuff!)

Cheers
Karen